Treatment of illiquid assets under Medicaid?

btl1953

My DW is probably a couple of years out from our needing to apply for Medicaid but it is certainly in the cards. I have been working with an Elder Law Attorney and at our relatively young age (DW and I are both 68 years old) it seem the best course is a Medicaid approved annuity and me taking advantage of the Community Spouse Resource Allowance. The whole application process to me seems contorted and confusing. Dealing with liquid assets seems pretty straight forward but when it comes to non-monetary assets -- collections (like coins, stamps, firearms, art work, antiques, etc,)  that are deemed as non-exempt resources -- I'm guess they have to be appraised to establish their value.

The appraisal of  physical assets to set a value on them is more than a little troubling to me.  Does the State working under Medicaid dictate the appraising entity or does the applicant get to chose an appraiser?  What if there is a dispute as to what the fair market value is?  So have any of the Forum Members here had experience with this?

Michael Ellenbogen

TThe question I would  ask is what do they know about on record?

Crushed

Michael Ellenbogen wrote:

TThe question I would  ask is what do they know about on record?

They look at financials for 5 years, they are experts at spotting applicants hiding money in asset purchases  

Ed1937

It seems to me that you should contact your elder law attorney for answers. Getting answers from others online could lead to a big mistake.

abc123

Ditto Ed! 

I’ll be following this thread. I’m curious about how collections are handled.

btl1953

Crushed wrote:

Michael Ellenbogen wrote:

TThe question I would  ask is what do they know about on record?

They look at financials for 5 years, they are experts at spotting applicants hiding money in asset purchases  

I think maybe the thrust of my question has been a little misunderstood. I'm aware that trying to hide an asset is not a good idea in fact I believe it constitutes Medicaid fraud which is a felony.  My question was concerning how Medicaid values a non-monetary asset like a collection of something.  How do they determine its value? Do they go to some kind of a Blue Book? Does the Owner just state its value? Do they require you to take the collection to an appraiser? If so does the cost of the appraisal get deducted from the value of the asset? Do you as Owner of the asset get to chose the appraiser? And so on.

So I was asking if anyone on this forum has been through this aspect of applying for Medicaid for a LO?

Quilting brings calm

I would ask your elder  care attorney that question.  

I want to thank you for raising this question though.  It’s something I didn’t know about. My step father has a few guns ( nothing valuable I am sure ) and a tote container of loose coins that isn’t valuable at all, but he has always  thought it is. He just rented  a safe deposit box because he was keeping the tote in his truck at the AL and said people kept getting into his locked truck and taking coins. .  The kind of coins the rest of us would take to the coin sorter at the bank and get bills in exchange. The guns are at a friends.   He will throw a fit when he’s told to get everything  appraised and have them counted as assets when it’s time for either of my parents to apply for Medicaid.  

Crushed

Quilting brings calm wrote:

I would ask your elder  care attorney that question.  

I want to thank you for raising this question though.  It’s something I didn’t know about. My step father has a few guns ( nothing valuable I am sure ) and a tote container of loose coins that isn’t valuable at all, but he has always  thought it is. He just rented  a safe deposit box because he was keeping the tote in his truck at the AL and said people kept getting into his locked truck and taking coins. .  The kind of coins the rest of us would take to the coin sorter at the bank and get bills in exchange. The guns are at a friends.   He will throw a fit when he’s told to get everything  appraised and have them counted as assets when it’s time for either of my parents to apply for Medicaid.  

A I understand it around here  a $250 gun regularly used for hunting or target shooting is a personal possession.  (sort of like furniture)  anything more is a collection or an asset.  

Quilting brings calm

== A I understand it around here  a $250 gun regularly used for hunting or target shooting is a personal possession.  (sort of like furniture)  anything more is a collection or an asset.  ==

Thank you Crushed.  That’s how I had been looking at it until I read this post. However I know he has more than one gun. Rifles and probably at least one handgun. .  Not sure how many total - maybe 5.  They would all be nothing special as neither he or his brothers ( all deceased) ever had any money to buy anything special. I never paid any attention to them when they were in the standard vertical locked  gun case. Which he no longer has. I will be reporting it when the time comes.  I doubt that it will raise either of them  over the Illinois spousal cap.  It’s just going to be a hassle  to accomplish what’s needed since  I don’t have possession of them.