Second time around + May/December jinx?

ButterflyWings

I am posting this excerpt from my reply on another thread. This is something I realized after reading occasional comments through the years, suggesting some people should have planned better for their golden years, yet many of us actually did plan well and work hard, but divorces and other factors cost us dearly in devastating ways - especially financially.

Combine that with the EO families' experiences, and or major age difference for some May/December couples like DH and me, which cut off significant parts of our wealth-building years and it is just havoc. No need to feel like we didn't plan well or think ahead, or work hard enough and that's why we are struggling. Often life simply intervened and became a big hole in the pocket. Even before AD. Recognizing this truth doesn't make their current reality any better, but it may help someone not feel dissed or dumb, on top of feeling devastated. Here's what I realized: 

I've been reflecting a lot lately that we both had very decent starts and sound plans, but those went out the window with the first marriage for each of us (to others) and lots of earnings and savings got depleted in doing right by ex-spouses and minor children at the time. The right thing to do, but it makes life more challenging financially from that point on. Like many blended families, starting over puts you at a distinct disadvantage and begins a race against the clock to rebuild some level of security and still (hopefully) a viable plan for an enjoyable retirement after gutting the "original" plans and many early years of savings and investment.

So, DH and I were on a good trajectory nonetheless. Then, here comes Alzheimers to completely obliterate the "round two" plans we made, which were very realistic and well underway -- yet not to be. For now, I can't even think about what I didn't know in time to keep DH from depleting our assets in the early stages of his illness, pre-diagnosis. But d@m#it it really does mean that being prepared at this point is a tragic impossibility or at least a very, very long shot that will take a miracle. I will just have to do the best I can with the worst set of circumstances we could never have imagined. I hope to survive his dementia, and if so, am praying to be healthy enough to resume work until age 70. Starting over again. Shaking my head. smh. We shall see.

Stuck in the middle

They say you can make God laugh by planning your life.

You are absolutely right, BW.  You had no way to prepare for what has happened to you, because you had no way to know the future.  

I'm not knocking hard work and thrift.  But there are no guarantees, as you know.

Stuck in the middle

As for May/December, marrying an older person increases your chance of becoming a caretaker.  The man next door married a woman ten years younger.  Now she has Parkinson's.  No guarantees.

abc123

Dear ButterflyWings, You certainly made some excellent points. I am so sorry about everything that has happened to you. I don't see how you could have possibly known what your DH was up to financially unless you had a crystal ball. It's so darn unfair, every single thing about this disease wreaks havoc in all directions. I lost my husband to cancer, we were both only 54. As terrible as his illness was and it was truly terrible, it only lasted 18 months. For his sake and mine also, it was a blessing that it only lasted 18 months. If only my sweet grannie, my dear MIL and now my fun loving mother, if only their suffering could have only been 18 months. That might seem terrible to some people that I feel that way, I hope not. I'm not in any way making light of cancer, never would I do that. 

I'm only 62 and I'm afraid to start a relationship because of things I read here and also things I have witnessed personally to second wives. We had a lovely couple for neighbors years ago, he was a doctor and she a stay at home wife & mother. They had two handsome sons, also doctors. Mrs Smith developed brain cancer and died within a short time. Mr Smith was lonely and remarried two years later. Mrs Smith #2 was a dear lady and we became friends with her also. They were very happy, they were social, enjoyed gardening together, etc. Several years into the marriage Mr Smith became ill. If I remember right, he also had some type of cancer. Mrs Smith #2 took excellent care of him until he died. She took him back and forth for treatment, ran the house, did everything! During all this time, we didn't see much of the grown sons. After their dad died they gave her 30 days to get out of their mother's house. That's the words they used, their mother's house. Money was not an issue with this family, not in the least! They sold the house from under her. We were in shock that these grown men, greatly educated and successful would behave like this. Their mother would have been so disappointed in both of them. Something very similar happened recently to an older friend from church. I don't know how some people can sleep at night. It's terrible. 

Please remember, you have all of us here! We are on your side. 

Ed1937

ButterflyWings, you have surely been dealt a shitty hand. I'm really sorry. When people do what is considered the right thing to do for their own futures, it should not be taken away like that.

Ed1937

Abc, please don't deprive yourself of a chance for love and happiness because of all the things you've heard and witnessed. There are no guarantees you will be happy, but there are surely no guarantees you will not either. You have a lot of time left, and you deserve whatever enjoyment you can get from it.

Crushed

abc123 wrote:

 Mr Smith was lonely and remarried two years later. Mrs Smith #2 was a dear lady and we became friends with her also. They were very happy, they were social, enjoyed gardening together, etc. Several years into the marriage Mr Smith became ill. If I remember right, he also had some type of cancer. Mrs Smith #2 took excellent care of him until he died. She took him back and forth for treatment, ran the house, did everything! During all this time, we didn't see much of the grown sons. After their dad died they gave her 30 days to get out of their mother's house. That's the words they used, their mother's house. Money was not an issue with this family, not in the least! They sold the house from under her. We were in shock that these grown men, greatly educated and successful would behave like this. Their mother would have been so disappointed in both of them. Something very similar happened recently to an older friend from church. I don't know how some people can sleep at night. It's terrible. 

In my humble legal opinion  Mr Smith was the one totally at fault and  Mrs Smith was simply naive and gullible.    My FIL remarried after my MIL died.  The prenup provided income for her and the right to live in his  house for the rest of her life.  When he bought a new house, he transferred the lifetime right to her.   

I will say my "step mother in law " was a wonderful person and the only grandmother on that side my children ever knew.  It was my job to make sure she got every penny a generous prenup provided but it was a pleasure.   

  

Quilting brings calm

Butterfly - I understand and agree.  Life happens while you make other plans.  Some people never seem to suffer tragedies or financial setbacks, while other families seem to have many.  Yes, it’s best to try to save money- but no  one knows how much they need, how soon they will need it.  Young couples just starting out surely can’t save  if their baby has a major illnesses.  A spouse dying in their 30s/40s or divorce in the same timeframe wrecks the finances.   Someone tells you to save x, but inflation makes x not nearly enough.  No one can save enough for 10+ years of dementia, unless like Crushed, they were blessed with a very good career etc. Even he has  posted that current expenses for the entire family are different than what was planned. 

Abc - I answered a post from Virgil the same way I will answer you.  There are all sorts and strengths of relationships. Not all need be serious enough for marriage or even anything more than just someone to do activities with. 

 I encourage you to  seek out someone to do things with, movies, dinner, travel.   Maybe it develops into more, maybe it never does.   There are plenty of people our age ( I’m 63) who want a relationship, but don’t want to combine finances or get married. 

 I’ve told my spouse more than once that I don’t intend to remarry if something happens to him.  That’s because I don’t want the money that he and I worked for to go to currently unknown relatives of some currently unknown future spouse.  I want that money to go to our sons. He said the same.  However we both also agreed that we would want to date, to have companionship. I’ve seen older relatives and friends do just that.  Date, even date exclusively, or but not combine households or finances. Of course, If he changed his mind and got remarried, that would be his right.  I would hope he would get some financial documents in order to make things fair for everyone. 

There is also the fact that I am very much still at the start of my parents dementia , while most most of you are much further. It’s already wearing on me,   I’m not a 24/7 caregiver.  I just don’t think I could marry someone at whatever age I would be doing it in the unknown future and then almost immediately becoming a caregiver for possibly many years, for what might be the rest of my life, with no history.   We’ve got people in that situation on this forum too. It’s something I would feel only appropriate to do for my spouse of 30+ years, but for a spouse of  just 2 or 3?   

As to the situation you mentioned, that was horrible also.  However, the husband failed to do what he needed to do to protect his second wife.  If he wanted her to be able to live in ( or even own) the house, he needed to put that in the will.  He could have changed the deed  on the house to one that meant she automatically got it after he died. Either of those actions would have prevented the son’s actions.  Even with my wanting my sons to inherit my money, I wouldn’t expect a future spouse to give up their home for them upon my death. I doubt either of that man’s sons needed his house or his money either 

dayn2nite2

Add me to the list of those who will never allow another romantic relationship in my life again.  After this is done, I am DONE.

I don't care how many legal papers and "plans" are made, I am tired of taking care of other people.  I will happily live the rest of my life with no long-term partner and taking care of myself only.

Crushed

dayn2nite2 wrote:

Add me to the list of those who will never allow another romantic relationship in my life again.  After this is done, I am DONE.

I don't care how many legal papers and "plans" are made, I am tired of taking care of other people.  I will happily live the rest of my life with no long-term partner and taking care of myself only.

I have a disabled 3 year old granddaughter we take care of one another.  She saved me from eating a whole pack of Fritos by using sign language to ask for one after another.  

 

loveskitties

I find it distressing that folks feel it is the lack of planning which puts others in a bad financial position.

Unless you squander your assets on things which you do without thought for the future, we can never estimate what it will cost to live a reasonable existence for the rest of our days.

Planning for any and all of the disasters which may befall us is just not possible for the average person.  You would have to be a millionaire many times over to do that.

The costs for a good facility or 24/7 in-home care will deplete anyone's savings at an alarming rate...for an unknown amount of time.  You also get hit with other related expenses...like having to hire help with home maintenance and other services which in the past you and your LO could have managed together.

I am happy that there are some who don't have the financial worries, but just because someone else does not have that luxury does not mean they have not tried their best to plan for the future.

PlentyQuiet

May/December? Check. Second marriage for spouse who had large financial obligations? Check. Careful planning to be on a track for financial stability where all needs are covered as well as most wants? Check. EOAD for spouse? Check.

I am trying to make decisions for today and the near future while weighing the costs long term. 

I am trying to provide for an enjoyable life while DH can still appreciate it.

I am trying to plan for future expenses while not impoverishing my future self. 

I am trying to image getting through this and being a widow before I'm 60. 

I am trying to see a future in the world that comes after.

I am trying. 

ButterflyWings

Thanks to everyone for your comments and perspective. This is really such a tough road for all of us. Wishing everyone the least possible hardship and heartache from here forward. It’s so true that the best laid plans... 

As for the future, I don’t know what I’ll be like when this is over. If approached on a romantic note anytime in the foreseeable future I may either run as fast as possible in the other direction, throw a punch, or laugh the poor person out of the room. After the dirty jobs, sleep deprivation,  f-bombs, and financial stress of this week alone...I’m just trying not to drown while dragging that “man overboard” as close to shore as possible. 

Truthfully right now, the person I’m starting to miss the most is me. So we will see when this assignment is over (if I am able to survive it in reasonable physical and mental health which is not a given ).  But for sure I will need and want some breathing room after all this. A lot of it. I will say I don’t blame my DH for any of this. He’d be mortified and beyond despondent if he knew the situation his diseased behavior has put us in. Anosognosia is a blessing in that regard.

Crushed, what a cutie. So nice to have little ones to help give us purpose and joy, despite life’s challenges.

Stuck - you nailed it. No guarantees.

abc - I get it. I’m so sorry for your lost LOs too, and everyone’s. I became an Alzheimer’s widow by mid 50s and didn’t even realize it for a while. Current status: grieving while drinking from the firehose and fending off predators (sometimes in-laws as we often see here on these boards). It is enough to make anyone say never again. Just trying to survive the next 24 hours for both of us can be terrifying, exhausting, and depressing. But the sudden loss of a love is soul crushing too. 

PlentyQuiet- for this day, I’m trying too. That’s the best we can do.

DrinaJGB

DH is 5 years younger than me and was only 52 when he nearly died of a viral brain injury. One day he is at work and the next morning he is in a Life Flight helicopter.

 Who can plan for that? He was a brilliant architect with many clients and at the peak of his career. Not in a million years were we prepared for the train-wreck headed our way. There is no rhyme or reason to any of this.

JJ401

Crushed wrote: In my humble legal opinion  Mr Smith was the one totally at fault and  Mrs Smith was simply naive and gullible.

 I think they were both naive. I doubt Mr Smith thought his children would do what they did. Moral of the tale— if you remarry, get a prenup. Protect yourself and your spouse.

Bill_2001

Great topic! Although I believe the term is "May/September." LOL

I am in such a marriage, and my goodness, I have thought of this A LOT. My conclusion is, don't waste your time worrying about that. I am old enough to have seen many marriages fall apart, people fall ill in same-age marriages, job losses, sons/daughters with big problems that derail plans, etc. I am convinced that married couples who retire together, with plenty of money, with nary a minor illness, and ride off into the sunset, are the exceptions.

We just notice them more because that is what we want.

As for the starting over for the third time and trying to play catch-up, that is something I am sure many people face. I am in my first marriage, to someone in the December of her life now, and I am firmly in October LOL. However, I am her second husband, so not sure how that fits into statistics. After this is over (if ever), I will face starting over in the October (or November) of my own life. What else can we do?

I struggle with caregiving, anger, depression, and sadness every day. But I am honored that this woman chose me nearly 30 years ago and had enough faith in me to know I would always be there for her. She would certainly do this for me if the tables were turned. Try to find pride in your task. You are a true American hero.

People that manage to avoid every set-back in life are simply very, very lucky.

Crushed

JJ401 wrote:

Crushed wrote: In my humble legal opinion  Mr Smith was the one totally at fault and  Mrs Smith was simply naive and gullible.

 I think they were both naive. I doubt Mr Smith thought his children would do what they did. Moral of the tale— if you remarry, get a prenup. Protect yourself and your spouse.

IMHLO With power , including financial power comes responsibility  Mr Smith had the POWER but he was irresponsible.

M1

I'd eat that bag of Fritos right now twice over, Crushed. Glad she was there for you and vice versa. What a sweet baby.

And God bless this forum. It helps so much to know I'm in such good company.

abc123

Hello my friends,

I came back to this thread specifically to look at the picture of this beautiful little girl!

SugarLove! SugarLove! This is something I say out loud and to myself when I see a child! All children are beautiful but sometimes I just have to shout SugarLove! SugarLove! Crushed, she's a doll!