Handling finances

mpang123

I'm curious…when my parents are deemed incompetent in handling finances, as POA, do I write checks for them to pay their bills? Do I sign their checks? I'm going to their banks and ask them to look over the POA papers that I filled out and make sure I did it right. As for their CDs, do I call them to let them know I have POA to sell their stocks? Do I need an estate plan to sell their property? I'm trying to do all this without getting elder law involved to avoid legal fees. I can't afford it.

Quilting brings calm

The short answer to most of that is yes. However you may run across individual organizations that refuse to accept your POA because they have their own form. I haven’t run across that yet but other posters here have mentioned it.

Start by going to the banks in question, and showing them your POA. I don’t know why you would need an estate plan to sell their house- is it in a trust? Talk to a realtor.

mpang123

Thank you. I'm gonna call all their banks, if not in person and the realtor. I'm trying to see if I need elder law to get involved. I know it's suggested but if I can do it myself, I'll try that first. Legal fees are so expensive.

M1

mpang, see if you can get your parents to agree to make you a signatory on their checking accounts. if they do that, you can access their bank records online and pay their bills online. Very easy and doesn't even require a POA if you are a signatory. Best to start this before there are any problems with late or missed bills.

If they have investments with other companies you may well have to request and have your parents sign POA forms from these individual companies. My partner had investments with Schwab and they would not accept a general POA, we had to fill out and sign their own proprietary forms for me to be able to access and manage her investment accounts.

mpang123

Thanks M1. I asked mom about creating online banking but she's weary of that. But if I tell her I need to set it up so I can better access her accounts to help her pay bills, especially when I'm POA, it would be easier. It's a matter of trust. I will ask for proprietary forms to sign for all her investment accounts too.

M1

you might use the argument with your mother that it's just the way business is done now (a lot of truth to that) and that all the banks and companies expect online payments. That helped my partner accept it when I took it over—as well as a lot of joking that I was working as her "executive assistant." She liked that. It worked best when I had the bills converted to e-bills so that paper bills never even showed up in the mail, as much as possible.

mpang123

M1, it makes sense to me. Convincing my mom is going to be a challenge. But I'm gonna try ..

Anonymousjpl123

Yes and I would be sure to contact the companies and see what specifically they need. My mom already had pretty advanced cognitive decline when my dad passed, and I found that starting with her bank was the best way to go (I was actually so unaware of her decline that her bank called me). So if needed, don’t hesitate to go in person to talk with them.

Also, you can literally do it with her like @M1 said the more she feels it’s just normal every day financial stuff the easier it will be.

Jeanne C.

Our bank needed to "process" the POA which took a couple of weeks (and several phone calls in addition to the in person appointment). Definitely get it handled before you actually need to use it - it may need be instant.

mpang123

Jeanne, I WILL be POA WHEN she is declared incompetent. Could I start all that BEFORE she is incompetent? I need a doctor's declaration.

Smilescountry

I don’t know if this helps or not, but I made a list of all financial institutions, doctors, income providers, etc. I then made a spreadsheet of everything so that I could keep track of where I was in the process of getting my name on as POA/HCR for each place. For most of the places there was a process to follow, so that helped me to keep track. Not all POA forms are equal, so if yours is not set up in just the right way, you will have trouble getting business done at some places. For example, my parents’ was over 35 years old, and Dad could not agree to changes, so I had to get letters about both parents from the doctor to show that they were not able to make legal or medical decisions. For their vehicle, we set up a transfer on death deed, but then we sold the car. We did something similar with the house, but then sold it. As POA, you can sign checks. I helped my mom set up a few online accounts, so it was a pretty seemless process for me to begin paying bills. I actually sold my parents’ property myself through a realtor that I knew.

mpang123

Thank you Smiles country, excellent suggestions!

Smilescountry

https://alzconnected.org/discussion/comment/210558#Comment_210558

Also, I would still seek the advice of a lawyer, if possible. I am wondering if your local council on aging would have suggestions for free or low-cost lawyers. You can get advice here, but it might not be accurate for your state of residence or your situation. My parents already had a will, as old as it was, so they were able to return to the lawyer who took over their lawyer's business to get advice for free and to update things for Mom, even if we couldn't for Dad. My husband has a legal services benefit from his former job that continues into retirement. We can get free legal services for things such as this. Financially, we had to update things for Dad through beneficiaries on accounts. The lawyer told us that in our state whoever is listed as beneficiary on any financial accounts trumps whatever is in the will. That way, we were able to make changes regarding one of my sisters who had passed away, even if Dad couldn't, because Mom was still competent to agree to the changes at that time.

harshedbuzz

Not seeing an (ideally elder law) attorney can be penny-wise and pound-foolish. None of us can give you legal advice applicable to your specific situation and TBH, the bank manager and Realtor can't really either.

Mom saw a CELA after dad was diagnosed to get the necessary paperwork in place. We did get a decent price (friends & family discount) as she felt she owed me for some help I'd given her son on his trail to Eagle Scout, but it would have been worth 10 x what mom spent TBH. I have heard of friends using boilerplate POAs found online and running into issues especially around banking and real estate.

Because the attorney knew the circumstances and the nature of the tasks I would be handling on behalf of my parents, she was able to write the POAs in such a manner that I was able to buy, rent and sell real estate, use credit cards, write checks, access investment accounts, make medical decisions for both as needed, etc. Most places will want to make a copy of the document to send to their legal department and in the case of real estate in the 2 states in which I sold property, the title company wanted the actual original to send to the county seat in order to transfer the deed. In both case, it was couriered back to me in about 3 weeks.

HB

mpang123

I need to tell mom we have to go see an elder lawyer. It will take convincing.

mpang123

Mom has to provide all the financial and legal documents to the lawyer and she has to sign the papers. Maybe I can get the palliative care SW or hospice SW to convince her if I can't.

Alexis D

I see you’ve already received a lot of replies. I handle all my mom’s admin, finances, etc. I am her POA and I sign documents using my [my name] POA [her name]. I handled the sale of her house and I take care of basically everything else that comes up. Sometimes signatures need to be very specific. Example: tax returns. So then I ask an accountant how to sign those papers. Hope this was somewhat helpful!

mpang123

Thank you Alexis. I'm struggling to get all this squared away doing the best way I can. It's challenging me as it seems I'm the only family member who cares about this. I wished my parents have planned ahead about this to save me the trouble but unfortunately not. Now I'm stuck with a terrible responsibility.

eaglemom

Look at it as an act of love for your parents. I think its wonderful you are trying to take care of things for them. I wouldn't concern myself with the other family members whom haven't stepped up to help you. You don't need to share any information with them, etc. IMO. All of that paperwork takes so much time. Your doing a good thing.

I know you said you couldn't afford a CELA, but maybe just make a phone call. From your parents funds possibly you could get a consult or some information. To me its worth the phone call.

eagle

mpang123

Eaglemom, I made some notes on how to seek elder law. I will seek initial free consultation. Get all questions answered, ask about sliding scale fee, or one time payment, or legal aid or any other financial help. I already have both medical and financial DPOA signed and notarized but don't know if it's sufficient. I want to ask about Medicaid planning too. I'm worried that my mom won't be willing to see the lawyer but just rely on the paperwork I've done on my own.

sakflva

Yes - to put the POA in. as a note, we had set something up and then later some my LO's house. We put the money into the financial advisor and they setup a new account - didn't consider the POA wasn't on it. It's fine - just saying that you periodically need to recheck. We are at the point that my LO is definitely incompetent - we are asking the doctor for a letter to put on file with the companies who she has assets with.