When did you insist they stop driving?



DH is in the early stages - mostly stage 3 with some stage 4. I do 90% of the driving, but on the occasions that he does drive, I haven't noticed any difficulties. However, I am noticing more instances of general confusion in following conversations, understanding instructions, maintaining a calendar, etc. He is awful with technology - including with figuring out the radio in his 3 year old car.
Made an appointment to have his ADL's evaluated and indicated the family has concerns about him continuing to drive. The therapist didn't really focus on driving activities and he scored 26/30 on the SLUM test after which the therapist stated they wouldn't typically refer for a driver's test with that high of score. Now DH thinks he should be able to drive all the time. Help!
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it’s 2 yrs was told by Nurologist no driving and she still can’t get over it or accept it. Matter of fact asked me today will she ever drive and why can’t she. I told her your getting confused and if you drive you don’t have 10 seconds to try and make a decision, had to tell her your getting confused and just asked me how to spell our last name she will bring up again as they forget one minute to next. My wife short memory just started getting bad last 6 weeks. But not driving was the worst so far. Keep the faith
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I was blessed by my DW that after she got confused about what her friends were yelling at her about as she backed into another car she came home, gave me the keys and told me she was done, and we needed to figure out what we were going to do with her car.
My neighbor is going through this with their mom and dad, the family is all close by and they are having a “heart to heart” meeting planned for their next get together. There have been some “fender benders” in recent weeks that have cost them. It’s hard .0 -
My DH was an excellent driver even into those earlier stages. One time he was driving to the dealer for car service (which he had done many times) but got lost - when I got home he told me about it and said that he began crying when it happened. I felt so bad for him. Other than this and not knowing our zip code to type in at the gas pump, there was nothing to indicate a problem with driving. However when I finally got him to take that 30 point test, he scored very low and the psychologist said he would have to report it to the DMV unless he took the Drive Able test (a computerized test of response times, etc). He refused to take the test so consequently lost his license. This was a very tough time, but he eventually got used to me driving and hasn’t asked about it since then.
Others have said that if there is a dementia diagnosis in his record and something happens, there may be issues with insurance, etc. If you’re concerned, it is definitely better to have a doctor be the “bad guy”, rather than him blaming you.1 -
As some have pointed out before, if an accident results in any kind of court appearance, there could be a considerable lag between the accident and the court date. During this time your LO could decline enough to make a very negative impression about their ability to have been driving in the first place.
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after my husband took the 4 hour test, the Neuro Psychologist called me and said under no circumstances should he be driving. The only thing I noticed was that he was driving very slowly. She said he had visuospatial difficulties and he could not judge time and distance and he could run into the back of another car or hit someone. IShe said since his diagnosis was in his medical records if he was in an accident even if it wasn’t his fault that we could be sued and lose everything. The insurance company could refuse to pay. I told him what she said and the next morning he brought me his keys and never drove again. I told him I was now his chauffeur. If your LO won’t give up the keys you must take control and even fib if you have to, disable the car if you must. Some have had the doctor tell them no more driving and that worked.
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I may have missed it in the comments, but what test are we talking about? I saw there was mention of a 30 minute test. What is that and who administers it?
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There are three common screening tools— MMSE, MOCA and SLUMS. These have 30 points available and take 10-30 minutes depending on how the person is coping with the testing. They are generally administered by PCPs, psychologists, specially trained nurses and OTs. MoCA and SLUMs have a training/cert process, but MMSE is available to download and use for anyone. There are some nuances to the tests including allowed prompts that might be harder to finesse for an untrained individual.
Normally these are given to screen who should be evaluated for dementia and later to get a quick snapshot of how the disease progression is impacting cognition and in what general areas.
IMO, in these are pretty crude tools for judging whether a person should be driving. Like the OP's DH, my dad tended to score fairly well on these tests. Along with showtiming for professionals, he came to dementia with considerable cognitive reserve and his scores tended to give a rosier impression than the reality at home. About 6 months before he died, he managed an MCI range MMSE score but didn't have the spatial reasoning, processing speed or executive function to drive safely. After dad took the test, he bragged all the way down to the valet stand about how smart he was. "Off-the-charts" was employed several times. And then he got into some random little old lady's car while she was dropping it off when my back was turned. I will never forget the look on that poor woman's face.
HB3 -
@MaryMN
Ugh. I feel for you on this one.
FWIW, a PWD is considered to be in the latest stage for which they have any symptoms or behaviors. So, straddling stage 3 and stage 4 is considered to be stage 4.
We were fortunate that dad's initial neurologist took the bullet for us and told dad he didn't drive or manage finances anymore. This allowed us to be his allies and validation his feelings of loss as we made sure he didn't drive. Of course, by that point dad's car looked like it'd been competing in demolition derby, and he'd lost $360K dabbling in day trading.
The point that made this easier to enforce is that his auto insurance policy became void the minute he was diagnosed with Alzheimer's. Even dad in his compromised state didn't want to risk everything he owned.
IMO, a person who can't work a radio should be allowed to operate the part of the car that can maim and kill people. But it's hard, especially with men who make driving their whole personality.
You might ask his neurologist to help with this although some leave it to families to deal with. You could also consider a special OT driving assessment; the therapist you saw wouldn't have the credentials to judge his fitness for driving. The downside here is they're expensive, not covered by insurance and are a snapshot of a single day in the context of a neurodegenerative disease. In some states you can report an unsafe driver to the DMV anonymously but the process of being retested can take considerable time if it happens at all.
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We were advised that once a doctor had given written recommendations that my wife should not drive, we found that if she did and caused an accident, our insurance would not be liable to pay any claims. An accident could wipe us out financially. Thankfully, my family helped support me as we delivered the news to my wife. She no longer has car keys, though I doubt she realizes her keys are hidden from her.
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No easy answer for this topic. DH still thinks he can drive. He checks his wallet for his Dr License, heads to the drivers side still after several years. He also still blames me, so be careful with phrasing and blame it on the doctor. Every day and I’m not kidding, “I have to call an atty so I can get my license back.” It’s terribly sad having to go through it still everyday. I apologize to him and just say “I’m sorry, but I need to drive today.” You must must do it tho, to possibly save a life. I can take a lot and I do over and over, but not the guilt if my DH would hurt or kill somebody cause of his impaired driving. I’m just so sorry, hopefully you’ll get compliance and it won’t be too bad.
Just as a side note, my DH retook his test at the neurologist request, but he passed both parts. There was still no way I was going to let him drive tho , seeing what I saw. After another six months, the neurologist turned him again, but this time she requested a psychiatric review, a substance abuse review and a cognitive review. All three papers came in the mail and when he saw it, I think he gave up a little bit. It’s still a struggle and so heartbreaking for him💜
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My DH's executive skills were really lacking as well as very slow processing and response time but his memory was good. I told him it was not safe for him to drive anymore. I'm sure he could start the car, keep it in the lines and probably get to the close grocery store but given the dynamic conditions when driving, any unforseen things that may come up would be a real challenge. If someone cut him off, ran a red light, a small child or dog ran out in the street, someone wrnt straight from a left turn lane or other bizarre things I've encountered, I know he would struggle. His privilege of driving is trumped by the need to keep him and others safe at all times. He never tried to drive again.
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The driving part has been in the top 2 hardest things so far in this journey. He always drove, he is a retired police sgt. who used to have EVOK training (emergency maneuvers, etc). I‘ve had to have the “talk“ many times and it kills me each time that I have to be the bad guy. The first couple of times, I included in my speech that it‘s not him that I don‘t trust, but everyone else on the road. Also that it is our civic duty to ensure that everyone is safe. He had a driving eval and did pretty bad on the book/exercises part. He gets flustered so very easily. And then the practical part he did just fine. So basically the recommendations they gave were already implemented in our life. No highway driving, no night driving, a specified radius in which he could drive with me and on his own for the 2 miles (rural) to the lake to do his daily walk. Then gradually, I started driving if it was anywhere else but the 2 miles and now he can only drive to the lake if we are together. He keeps testing the waters recently but I remind him each time that this is what was agreed upon with him and the Dr. Thankfully, we will be spending the fall-spring in Brooklyn so we can walk everywhere or do Ubers and subways.
I wish you strength and respite and know that it‘s the right thing to do. Put your suit of armor on, detach from yourself and the situation and say/do what you have to.
The biggest life lesson I learned was when walking in the French Quarter in New Orleans:
A homelss man was walking down the sidewalk and asked every person that passed by him for some money. I observed how everyone either said no or ignored him, but he was unfazed. Just shook off the rejection and moved on to the next person. THIS is what I try to do when driving comes up. I have to reject the request to drive, put up my shield and move on because I know it will happen again and again.
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This was not the issue I feared it would be. On some level deep down I guess my DH knew he shouldn’t be driving.
DH is solid stage 5 currently. At stages 4 and 5 we would go out everyday with him behind the wheel and he was very aware he couldn’t remember how to get to familiar places we’d been to hundreds of times.
I was the petrified navigator (saying turn right and he’d turn left, OR turn right at the traffic light up there ahead and he’d turn right immediately when I said it). I feared for our lives, certain our story would end in a fiery auto accident.
At the same time his driving abilities were deteriorating he was also regularly misplacing his copy of our car key. We would spend hours every few days looking for his car key (also glasses, wallets, etc).
So a year ago, when I came upon his copy of the car key, I just put it aside in my file cabinet that he doesn’t go into (so far) and since I’m the only driver now with a car key, he doesn’t protest when we go out to the car - and I just go and get behind the wheel. He pretty much accepts it.
There’s been only about two or three times that hes protested about not driving and I just fib and say that his dr recommended he not drive, and he readily accepts it.
Thank God this was not the big issue for us that I thought it would be.1
Commonly Used Abbreviations
DH = Dear Husband
DW= Dear Wife, Darling Wife
LO = Loved One
ES = Early Stage
EO = Early Onset
FTD = Frontotemporal Dementia
VD = Vascular Dementia
MC = Memory Care
AL = Assisted Living
POA = Power of Attorney
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