Father's Illness Holding 23 Year Old Son Back; Need Advice
I am the caregiver for my DH with Alz. Our oldest son works from home and has moved in with us in the country (rural area) to help financially and practically. He is 34. Our youngest son (23) lives with our daughter (33) in the city and they both visit frequently. She visits every other week for 4 days & our youngest (23) works freelance so when he comes to visit he stays longer, usually a few weeks at a time. He has built a fence for us. He helps with big chores and he's good company.
I have tried to talk to our youngest about his future, career choices and plans but he gets very defensive and emotional and says he will keep doing what he's doing: working freelance, making some money, then coming up for a stretch.
I am concerned that he is stuck (and he says he is) but he does not want to talk about changing anything. He smokes marijuana and plays video games every day. He likes to work and earn money and he helps with chores. He's not lazy, but he has anxiety (he's on med) and I want to help him live up to his potential. I appreciate all the children's help but I worry that this illness—which has dominated all our lives for two years and could carry on for another decade—could be holding them back in life, especially the youngest.
I told my youngest that times passes quickly and we all have to live our lives and plan for our futures as best we can. I told him I am the one who gave up my career and I am their father's caregiver. I appreciate all the help, but the rest of you have to go on with your lives. He says he doesn't want to talk about it and goes upstairs to smoke some pot then comes back down all relaxed and hangs out with his dad watching sports.
Maybe I should not push him. My older kids are both worried that he won't live up to his potential. He's stubborn, has always been an underachiever at school, but dedicated to helping people and doing his own thing. He's dedicated to his family. He's very empathetic. I don't know whether to give him more space or push him more. I dont want to fail him or any of them.
Comments
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==Maybe I should not push him. My older kids are both worried that he won't live up to his potential. He's stubborn, has always been an underachiever at school, but dedicated to helping people and doing his own thing. =
Is it possible that what he’s doing now at 23 has less to do with his dad and more to do with his personality? This just might be who he is. Appreciate his good parts, but don’t enable him. If you don’t want him smoking pot in your home, then say so. Don’t just allow it and resent it inside.
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Thank you @Quilting brings calm That's what I am thinking, too. I appreciate his good parts, very much. We are very bonded. —he's very different from his older siblings—older brother is an achiever and sister worries too much about him & me—He is young, but he's still an adult making his own choices. He likes helping me and his dad, but it's upsetting for him to see his dad fading. He does not seem to blame me/us for holding him back, I just want to be sure that I am doing what I can to support and encourage him. Re: smoking pot, he usually goes outside to smoke. I don't really care, I just don't know if it's doing him long term brain damage & I am concerned about his health—that said, he won't stop … certainly not just because I tell him or ask him to—I have tried.
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Marijuana kills motivation. As long as he's smoking, he won't have motivation to move along in his life. I knew a man like this, it was a huge tragedy because he was very intelligent and had a lot of potential. He could find work but quickly got fired. Playing video games is addicting, also decreases motivation. He's very comfortable now because he is being enabled. There is the concept that partakers have to reach bottom before they are motivated to change.
There are Al-Anon groups for family members to help them understand. These groups help for more than alcohol abuse. There may be groups specific for Marijuana and other drugs, but probably not in your rural area. There may be online meetings and/or books you can read. I could not help my LO with this serious problem, but I did learn a lot. The main thing I learned was that I could not fix him, nor could I motivate him to change. He had to want to change himself. Eventually he did, years later, after a lit of heartache and disappointment and after all of his potential had been destroyed.
Iris
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23 year olds today are not what we were…lol. No amount of worry will change that. I have had to learn that first hand.
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@AlzWife2023
This is some of the hardest part of parenting. Accepting the child who lives with you rather than the one who is like those you're used to. At 23, many his age are not fully launched but I can see where the distraction of his dad's illness/your need for all-hand-on-deck could be an excuse to take next steps to an independent adulthood with responsibilities and mature relationships. Presumably, you and your DH set him up as you did his siblings and only time will sort him out.
The gaming and daily marijuana use would concern me as addictive in some individuals but not in others. I know plenty of folks, mostly men, who do one or both as a way to relax after they've done their share of adulting. What's his freelance work look like? Is it something he could build a career around?
Because sibling rivalry can be really ugly, I would remind the older ones that their brother gets to make his own decisions. If they have a concern, I would encourage them to approach their brother in a non-judgmental manner and leave you out of it. You don't need the mental load of their shenanigans.
HB1 -
I’m going to show my age here. I think the younger generation overall lacks motivation and drive. I also believe many are emotionally weak ( or maybe just not emotionally strong). My mom has dementia and she is a hoarder with a full house that needs to be gone through. I have no help from my brother. My youngest son is having some major mental health issues. But if I try to talk to either of my two older children they shut me down and change the subject. They tell me it all too much for them. They are not helping or actively involved in any way yet it’s too much for them to deal with hearing about it? I hope they never have to go through what I am, I can’t imagine how they would get through it.
I would imagine your son is using the pot to self medicate and get through and emotionally difficult time. It’s good your son is being helpful. I think activity is good. Keep him busy. Maybe that means less time to mope and get stuck in his own head. Just an idea. Parenting is so difficult. Ultimately they decide how they want to live their life.2 -
Wow, I love this response! Thank you.
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good advice! Thank you!
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I think it is his personality. Thank you for your reply.
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All the comments with different perspectives have been very helpful. Thank you!
PS he did not play video games for three days (let his older brother binge during the visit. I overhear them talking about it). I also asked him to stop smoking for his health & that is all I can do.
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My response may be affected by having 100% of my parenting experience involving executive functioning difficulties (in both my children). I wonder if he has an undiagnosed executive functioning disorder like ADHD, or even autism, or some learning disability that was not uncovered during school. You can have normal, above average, and even genius range IQ and still have specific areas that are much harder for you than for others. Maybe adulting or certain parts of life are truly harder for him? And anxiety can definitely be a symptom of unrecognized EF difficulties (or an additional diagnosis in itself). Substance use is much, much higher in people with ADHD than without it. And interestingly, there is a theory that video games can act almost like a stimulant in people with ADHD, increasing dopamine levels in the brain. In adulthood evaluations for some of these issues unfortunately can be expensive depending on the type of evaluation. But they ran through my head as I read your post. Sending you hugs—-parenting is not for sissies.
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thanks @housefinch that’s really interesting. I will look into it. I really appreciate your posting!
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You’re very welcome! I hope he finds his way. 💕
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@housefinch
Given my experience, your response is where my head went as well.
HB1 -
this is fascinating. I really know nothing about executive functioning disorders like ADHD etc. but I remember my son had a very, very, very hard time with transitions as a small child & also that he would get in trouble at school when he was only 5-7 and did not know why. I homeschooled him for three years because I thought school was tagging him as a bad boy and he always seemed stressed and never wanted to do homework. We had a good time but he needed more friends and routine. When he went back to school in fifth grade it was sort of the same. The teachers were literally picking on him. I transferred him to a tiny local Catholic school where he did way better because they let him be himself. He did lots of chores like pet care, helping in the younger grades and lunch room. He received a community service award from the City. Then HS was another roller coaster.
So… looking back I thought this was all due to anxiety and a strong will (anxiety finally diagnosed and treated due to breakdown in college about father’s Alzheimer’s).Now I’m wondering if it’s something else. How would I know?
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Hmmmm. I would probably encourage you to read more about ADHD and autism and see if those descriptions seem familiar. Difficulty with transitions can be seen in both ADHD (related to weak “task switching” between activities) and can be severe in autism (also from weak task switching plus rigidity and an inability to have a plan b when plan a doesn’t work). Severe tantrums at age 5-7 (epic ones) are a very common problem faced by parents with children ultimately diagnosed with ADHD or autism—-especially with autism. And unfortunately, especially 35 years ago, these behaviors were seen as behavior problems (misbehaving) and reflections on parents, instead of a manifestation of specific skill deficits in the child because of brain wiring. It’s incredibly traumatic as a parent to endure those—-been there! These kids (undiagnosed) get much more negative attention at school than positive and their self confidence ends up terrible. Common times to see them struggle again are with increases in workload (starting MS, HS, college).
Sorry, I’m not answering your original question. Getting a diagnosis of ADHD in adulthood may be challenging if he is really using marijuana regularly, but a good psychiatrist might be able to tease out his reasons for using it (social anxiety? Difficulty reading social cues and knowing how to have a social conversation? Etc). Many regular PCPs don’t want to diagnose ADHD in adults because they worry people might be drug seeking for stimulants. For autism, many psychiatrists might be comfortable saying someone has features suggesting it. However, it’s possible he would need a comprehensive assessment by a psychologist (our son’s was $2000–cash pay, not insurance). But the understanding we gained of him and how to stop berating ourselves as parents was worth it (we went outside of insurance bc he was missed by 8-9 professionals before finally getting diagnosed). Sorry for writing so much—-this is an area of personal & professional interest for me.1 -
Don’t apologize! Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I have read a bit & he does not have any of the classic signs. I think anxiety is his biggest issue & he is very hard headed (which is a real thing LOL) but he reads social cues very well, never had tantrums, etc. He is able to focus. I appreciate all the insights b/c it boils down to really trying to understand him to be the best parent I can be for him now.
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Today's grass isn't yesterday's - much more potent. That can't be helping sorting out his basic brain chemistry.
Very hard to figure out how much is him coping, not wanting to face reality or biology. Maybe you can suggest that since brain issues are in the family he may want to try to pare back to give his brain a rest .
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That’s very true & a good idea. I feel that he’s not ready to give up the weed as a crutch but it’s a terrible thing b/c it’s so potent and he’s been smoking since he was a teen.
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I'm in a similar situation - although my youngest will be 28 a couple of weeks. While he is not currently living with me - moved back east last February. There is some talk about moving back to California. I'd be happy to help with accommodation, free Room and board if no Pot and enroll in at least one class.
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@AlzWife2023
It's really hard to say. Your description of your son as a younger kid sounds very like DS. Even down to the pet care. DS is an alphabet-soup kid— he has high functioning ASD (formerly known as Aspergers), GAD (added as an adult, but he was always anxious), ADHD (combined-type) and dyslexia. This makes it hard to tease out what symptoms/behaviors are caused by each— it's usually a mix.
DS struggled with school and with teachers, too. It wasn't that he was a bad kid; it was that he didn't realize he was a kid and that the unstated rules of the classroom applied to him. Many teachers read this as disrespect and made our lives miserable. Relationships with peers weren't much better for a long time. Classmates were confused by him; they knew he was "different", but they didn't always extend the grace they might a child with an obvious disability. ASD brings a degree of developmental delay. DS wasn't flagged as a toddler because his speech was advanced for age, he met all the usual gross motor stuff but was about 1/3 behind chronological age in terms of social and emotional maturity. Things started to improve in high school for us. By then he'd had lots of help and had a fairly safe community of his scout troop and bandmates.
I agree with Housefinch's suggestion to read about what these differences look like in a younger child/adult and see if it seems familiar. Sometimes a bright kid develops their own strategies to overcome the areas in which they struggle so it can be harder to recognize later on. Your son had the benefit of older sibs who probably "guided" him in behavior expectations when he was younger which can mask symptoms. It's sounds like they might still do this.
Sometimes kids slip through the cracks for a whole lot of reasons. My cousin was only diagnosed with ASD at 30-something after my son was after years of comparisons between the two. By this point he was a self-trained systems engineer who'd never gone to college. He was a devoted son to his parents. He was also a daily pot user. FWIW, DS would say his dad is his best friend.My niece was diagnosed with ADHD only after she moved in with us to pay off her student loans from grad school. We were always very close, especially after her mom died when she was 14. But it was only after watching her close up that I recognized the ADHD piece. I got her a copy of Driven to Distraction (written by a doctor with ADHD) and asked her if any of it felt like it fit. It did. She was diagnosed by DS's psychiatrist. His colleague diagnosed my mom with ADHD at 81.
Sometimes these sorts of things run in families. In the support groups and fora I visited, once a kid is diagnosed with one of these differences, parents start to recognize similarities in themselves of their siblings. Anecdotally, at least years ago, many of the kids being diagnosed with ASD had a very successful dad who had some traits themselves.
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@harshedbuzz Your post mirrors our experience. Our son was diagnosed only after we had another child with ASD/ADHD/ID. Then I pushed hard for someone to explain why my husband and I were crying every Sunday evening when our son was 3-8 years old.
My only other suggestion is that a speech therapist who really specializes in social/pragmatic communication can do a pragmatic communication evaluation to see if someone has difficulty understanding social cues and communicating in a typical way. This is totally different from someone mispronouncing words, sounds, stuttering, etc. Our son has an amazing vocabulary and fund of knowledge from reading voraciously since age 3. Totally flunked the pragmatic communication evaluation. After reading the report, I suddenly understood his challenges for the first time in 12 years. Also, everyone described him as determined, stubborn, never giving up—but really he was rigid. Sometimes the rididity of autism isn’t recognized and is mischaracterized by observers as other traits. Just some additional 2 cents.1 -
It’s so hard to put these conditions I find b/c they just don’t want to give it up! I hope it works out.
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Amazing similarities!
I’ll keep reading!
Thank you!
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Interesting—the distinction between stubborn and rigid.
Thank you for sharing your experience!
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