Avoid all types of confrontation?

Shan456

Hello,

My husband is newly diagnosed, and I have so many questions. I'll start with just one today.

For background: My husband is 56, and he has had memory issues for about three years, probably longer. He went through many doctor's appointments and tests and received the final diagnosis last month.

I attended an Alzheimer's Association support group last week and learned so much already. I understand that I should just answer his repeated questions with grace and that I should avoid any arguments.

I have a question about avoiding arguments.

To make a long story, short: Our son has Autism and loves plugging up the toilet with toilet paper. We have a toilet snake and need to use it several times a week. My husband started using the toilet snake wrong, and so the toilet is scratched up and ugly. I told him how to use it the right way, and he got really mad and said he knew how to use it. But he continues to scratch the toilet more. It's our guest bathroom toilet, and I'm embarrassed how it looks. And I'm frustrated that I'm not supposed to do anything about it. I hear it: this seems like a minor issue. And maybe you're thinking of how to give advice for dealing with my son's behavior or how to best unclog a toilet. But my point with this story as that my scratched toilet has become a symbol of my new life. I'm just supposed to accept scratches to avoid arguments.

Now my question: Am I really supposed to just let everything go to avoid all arguments? That doesn't seem healthy for me, bottling up everything inside and not sticking up for myself. Are there any communication strategies that help both the patient and the care partner?

Kat63

Welcome to our group and sorry you have to be here. I can explain what I have done in circumstances like this and sure others will chime in as well. I have found it does not help to keep explaining how to use things as they can no longer remember how to use them the proper way or remember the instructions you just gave them. Instead I hide whatever I do not want my husband using anymore. I have had to put so many things where they really don’t belong, but it’s what is needed. My husband cannot help that he does not understand what something is or how to use it. It is the disease. You have to be the one to figure out how best to handle each situation and a work around.

JDancer

Yes, talk is rarely helpful. Take whatever action is needed to prevent the negative activity. In this case, hide the snake or disable the tiolet so you're the only one that flushes it to prevent clogs.

Timmyd

"Am I really supposed to just let everything go to avoid all arguments?"

I believe we have to allow ourselves space and opportunity to be human. It is not realistic to let everything go and avoid all arguments. You can be upset, argue, show anger, and still understand that the disease is the cause of the behavior and getting upset does not improve anything. I get upset with DW and still understand that it is not her fault. It happens less often and I don't like how I feel afterwards, but the alternative of letting EVERYTHING go is not the person I am ready to be right now.

Russinator

((HUGS))

Iris L.

It helps to become proactive, not reactive. Dementia-proof the home. Remove everything dangerous or problematic.

You dont have to "let everything go", meaning you don't have to accept chaos in the home.

Also learn not to argue but to redirect.

A member had posted "10 Absolutes" I will try to search for it.

Here is the link.

https://alzconnected.org/discussion/69319/10-absolutes-in-dementia-care-list

There is a group for new members in the Groups section.

Iris

CindyBum

I have to admit to struggling with the advice to “NEVER argue”, because I’m a mere human that occasionally up and argues. Ha!

That said…I strive daily. I believe that is the healthier approach than the rather American black and white statement of “never”. We are not perfect and never will be in this life. So gentleness with yourself will be important, I think. As a former German professor, I could do a whole treatise on the German Enlightenment and striving, but I’ll spare you all.

The striving thoughts, seriously helps. My DW can’t reason…but I can reason her away from certain things because my brain still works. That may mean a distraction or a therapeutic fib or sometimes just saying, “that’s not what we’re going to do.”

You will find your way with this as you realize arguments tend to be worthless or worse and finding ways around your LOs broken reasoner pays off much better than trying to work with him as he once was.

Xoxo

harshedbuzz

Hi and welcome. I am sorry for your reason to be here but pleased you found this place. Yous asked:

Am I really supposed to just let everything go to avoid all arguments? That doesn't seem healthy for me, bottling up everything inside and not sticking up for myself. Are there any communication strategies that help both the patient and the care partner?

TL;DR? "yes".

That is best

practices

Understanding the Dementia Experienc

harshedbuzz

This site is making me crazy— continued from my previous post.

That is best practices both in the short and longer term. Not just to maintain peace in the household that is also challenged by a child with ASD's behaviors but also going forward. (ASD mom here. What is with kids on spectrum and toilets??) Emotional intelligence persists well into the disease process; you want your husband to see you as his advocate and ally and that's best by not sweating the small stuff a goal.

You won't always succeed, and you should extend yourself much grace when you stumble, but it's still a worthy goal. The first rule of dementia fight club is that one doesn't try to reason with a person who has a broken reasoner and that would include explaining why he shouldn't use the snake improperly as or trying to correct delusions or misremembered facts.

I really feel you on the toilet. I do understand the burning desire to have some scrap of normality in the face of dementia. It's one of those unsaid facts about dementia that only comes up among those living it. Dementia is expensive. And not just care. PWD are often irresponsible with money and destructive. If dad wasn't losing his nest egg day-trading or signing up for autorenewal subscriptions or pay-per-view extras on cable or taking random things out of the freezer to spoil, he was breaking things. He'd disconnect his entertainment system ("because everything is wireless these days"), and it would take hours to find the cables and reconfigure it. He broke countless remotes and 3 sets of headphones in the last 15 months of his life. He also rocked all the toilets off their seals spilled all over the couch and carpet. My poor mom— she just wanted a nice, normal home since her time away from it was so limited.

The posted link above helped mom get to a place where she could mostly roll with the punches. Mostly. Medication (for both of them) and a support group helped her a lot.

You are wise to prioritize your health and emotional well-being, but that may be harder to accomplish than you realize.

HB

HollyBerry

I understand what you're saying (I think!) and I feel it, too. In any other setting, we would NEVER put up with the things we put up with, we would NEVER allow anyone to speak to us the way we are spoken to, and I question daily whether my young niece will be scarred for life witnessing someone treating their partner so poorly. And, at the same time, we tiptoe around and try to avoid conflict and feel like some other kind of dysfunctional person who tries not to wake the sleeping ogre.

Prevention is great when you can make it work. Humor is great too, if you can use it to redirect. Yelling and screaming feels good in the moment and rotten later (sometimes it just feels good). Prevention is probably the only thing that actually works, along with grace, when it doesn't. There's a point when you decide that as much as you hate the mess, you'll clean it up later because they're doing something that gives them a feeling of accomplishment, and that doesn't happen very often.

sandwichone123

From my perspective, the target is to choose your battles. At the moment, you have a scratched-up toilet and a spouse that still thinks they can snake it. You could write off the toilet and let your spouse continue to think he's helping, or you could replace the toilet and lock up the snake. Partly that would depend on how often you host guests and how much they understand about the situation, but at some point you will no longer have a spouse that thinks they can help, and you can replace the toilet at that point if you haven't already.

There are communication strategies that help, and you learned some of them in your first meeting, but communication doesn't help problems like this because he's not able to do the task regardless of the communication strategy.

SDianeL

You can talk till you’re blue in the face and he won’t understand or agree because he can’t. His reasoner is broken. You can tell him over and over how to use the snake but he won’t remember because his memory is gone. Correcting and arguing with him will only cause him anxiety and increase his agitation. I do believe the goal should be no arguing. Can we human caregivers do that all the time? Probably not but with practice we get better at it. Every day I would repeat, over and over, the mantra I learned here. “You can’t reason with someone whose reasoner is broken” that helped me not correct him or argue with him. (If the toilet is scratched by metal you might be able to scrub it with cleanser or magic erasures if it’s not deep scratches).

H1235

Don’t argue, they are always right is only half of the strategy. All alone this gives the impression the pwd should just be free to do whatever they want. That’s not the case. The other half to this is workarounds and fibs. You want to let the pwd think they are right, but behind the scenes do what needs to be done. It can take some creativity to come up with solutions that work. In the case of the toilet, I agree with hiding the toilet snake. Maybe tell him it broke and you need to pick up a new one. I think eventually for most there comes a change in mindset. The reality of how dependent he is on you and how you really are the one making ALL the decisions. Realizing that while on the surface he may always win the argument in reality you are the one in control and need to be to maintain the household.

Maru

https://alzconnected.org/discussion/73365/avoid-all-types-of-confrontation

I avoid all confrontations. I know it isn't healthy for me but my DH's brain is broken so arguing is just plain pointless. The awful thing is that when I shut down that part of me, I shut down other feelings also.

tboard

https://alzconnected.org/discussion/73365/avoid-all-types-of-confrontation

I have a hard time not arguing with DH who has mixed dementia. Before I say anything I ask myself if I really want to argue with a disease. I don't need to argue with a disease and I can usually find some other outlet for my frustration and anger by taking a brisk walk. It gets easier all the time. I avoid all confrontations because they accomplish nothing and there isn't any point in arguing with a disease.

tonyac2

As @SDianeL always reminds me, you can’t reason with someone whose reasoner is broken. Ain’t that the truth. I forget once in awhile and find myself talking until I’m blue in the face. My DH has totally destroyed our beautiful kitchen cabinets with his wheelchair. We have a two butt kitchen and he has a large chair that scrapes the cabinets, stove, dishwasher, fridge. Our house is small, very few places for him to roam in his big chair. Not feasible to block everything off, he’d go nuts. I just look at it as being cosmetic damage that one day can be repaired. It’s all so sad and frustrating.

beachbum

I’m learning to pick my battles and let things go. My DH has pretty much ruined my area rug in the living room by spilling things and obsessively picking at the threads. I would love to redo some floors but I’m just going to wait. It sounds cold but I plan for the “after” to help me get through the current. I have in my head the after dementia list of things I want to replace and redecorate. I’m sure things will get worse than just the rugs and I’m trying to plan accordingly, I’m positive remotes will be broken. He is 58 and diagnosed 1 1/2 yrs ago, I think he is probably towards late stage 4. I would say stuff and get frustrated, now I think it can be replaced after. Anyone coming to our house knows and I’m like well just look over it.

jfkoc

Confrontation will, simply put, get you no where so ??????

1. have your son use another toilet
2. switch out toilets
3. https://www.google.com/search?q=toilet+scratched+by+snake&oq=TOILET+SCRATCHED+BY+SNAKE&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqBwgAEAAYgAQyBwgAEAAYgAQyCggBEAAYgAQYogTSAQkxODE4NGowajeoAgCwAgA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

4. change toilet paper

annie51

This has been a good discussion. One of the books I read mentioned the term DIRM…”does it really matter?” Something to ask yourself when “things” happen. My answer to that question has changed as DH has progressed. Today he proceeded to cut off a very large amount of a climbing cactus plant from our tree that produces the most beautiful flowers - ordinarily this would have caused me to freak out, but he was so focused and it occupied him for over an hour and I’m sure he felt useful, so I asked DIRM? Only you can answer for each situation but it gives you perspective on what’s really important. We all have argued and tried to explain when we know it’s pointless, but we do the best we can.

l7pla1w2

Another way to look at it: Is what the PWD doing or saying a health or safety risk to self or others? If not, try to let it go.

Shan456

You are all amazing. I felt so alone. My husband has been my best friend, and now I can't really talk to him about this or daily life. We went through months of doctor appointments and tests. And once we got the final diagnosis, I felt like that was it. I asked the Neurologist what we can do, and she said to get a tracking device on his phone and a large calendar. Since my husband didn't want meds, she said we should check in with her in about six months. That was it. Many different professionals helped my son when he was diagnosed with Autism: Speech Therapists, Occupational Therapists, Behavior Therapists, etc. But with Alzheimer's, there is nothing? You have all been so helpful; I am so grateful.

Timmyd

The most succinct and profound things I was told early on was as the spouse of a PWD, my job is to "manage the decline".

My DW family is always asking about doctors visits and medicine with the expectation that there is some hope modern medicine can make this journey easier for us. It is hard for them to accept that we are mostly on our own with this disease. They seemed surprised each time I report to them after a doctor appointment, that nothing new has been offered.

jehjeh

I can't seem to get over the anger that comes from knowing how many families are struggling through this, yet, for the most part, we all seem to be on our own. This site helps me a lot. Knowing that I'm not doing anything wrong, just experiencing what everyone else is, is a great relief. But the medical profession either hasn't caught up or they are overwhelmed and don't have time or knowledge to deal with this. Doctors and nurses have been very consoling (most of them) and acknowledge what caregivers are going through but spend very little time with us and have very little to offer. DH on day 10 of hospital stay. Dr. today saw us a year ago and he said he wanted to know how I'm doing. I almost cried. No one asks me that aside from 2 very good friends. And he listened. He recognized what was happening and assured me they will handle getting husband to SNF when he's released from hospital. I know he'll fight me on it and we never got DPOA in place.

Praying for all who are on this path.

sandwichone123

The US healthcare model is based entirely on the "identified patient." Back in the day, before "run like a business" was the operating model, you would see much more care for the family, but now the family caregiver is not part of a billable unit.

In addition, healthcare workers know little about the management of dementia. Doctors are trained to cure, and when something can't be cured they have little to say. Nurses are trained to care for people where they are, but have little expertise that would help support family caregivers. And the system as a whole does not see the needs of PWD as "medical" and therefore covered by insurance.

Iris L.

People have to advocate for what they want. People with HIV-AIDS and cancer used not to get much support, but now they do. Groups like the Alzheimer's Association and US Against Alzheimer's and others advocate for PWD and family. The problem is that most families are too exhausted to do much outside of their caregiving efforts. Also, the majority of families probably are not aware of what support is available. For example, out of five million PWDs, only a few hundred have made use of this excellent online support group. Here is where your questions are answered and where you get useful support.

Families have to keep advocating and making their needs and wants known to authorities who can do something.

Iris

Pier Walker

The best advice when my DW was diagnosed, sometimes she needs to extend me grace and sometimes I need to extend her grace. His point - we will be human and get upset. I struggle with this exact same issue. I finally found a therapist who has been a game changer. She has helped me find outlets for my anger instead of arguing, though I am not perfect yet either. I have a playlist of songs, I go into the garage and let out my frustration so she doesn't see it. Sometimes she does see my frustration. I feel bad and try to forgive myself and her. So sorry you are dealing with this.

Mitsu2

That's a difficult challenge, but I've learned from experience that arguing or sometimes even redirecting just leads to more agitation and he doesn't remember what we talked about. My husband started writing in library books recently, nothing to do with the book but more like it was a notebook. If I tried to talk with him about it, he'd get angry and defensive, sometimes hitting himself with the book. After paying $60 in library fines for damaged books, I just use the library system for kindle books now.

H1235

I know this is off topic, but just wanted to point out that one of the first things suggested to us by the doctor was to see a lawyer and get everything in order.

harshedbuzz

@Shan456

You said:

Many different professionals helped my son when he was diagnosed with Autism: Speech Therapists, Occupational Therapists, Behavior Therapists, etc. But with Alzheimer's, there is nothing? 

Fortunately, Early Intervention and IDEA provide supports and a safety net as an investment in the future because children with developmental delays and disabilities can learn and gain skills. Sadly, that argument can't be made for dementia although SLPs, OTs and PT are sometimes used to help maintain skills and advice caregivers on strategies to help them.

HB

JeanGayre

I agree…you must hide the items he can no longer use properly. This will keep your sanity. Get the items out when you need to and then put them away.

For your toilet, if it cannot be fixed and it drives you crazy then you can replace it for about 100 dollars at home depot and get your plumber to install it. A shiny new toilet might make YOU feel better.

Take care of YOU so you can take care of him. Otherwise you will feel resentful. This is a team effort. You have to take care of the entire team and you are the new leader. Take charge.

The best part is, if he gets mad he won't remember why he's mad at you. And he won't stay mad long. Once you feel better, he will too.

Deepsea

https://alzconnected.org/discussion/73365/avoid-all-types-of-confrontation

Thank you for sharing so honestly, I can really feel the weight of what you’re carrying right now, and your scratched toilet analogy says so much. It’s not just about the toilet. It’s about the heartbreak of watching your life change in ways you didn’t ask for, and the frustration of feeling like you can’t even speak up without starting a conflict.

You’re not alone in this, and your feelings are completely valid. No, you’re not supposed to silently accept everything and bottle it all up, that wouldn’t be fair to you. What’s true is that arguing or correcting often doesn’t work the same way it used to, and it can cause distress for someone with dementia. But that doesn’t mean you stop expressing your needs, it just means the how might shift.

Here are a few strategies that might help, this might be quite long though:  

Redirection and reframing: If something like the toilet snake keeps getting misused, maybe find a way to reframe the task. Could you gently say something like, “Hey, let me take care of the clog this time , I’ve got a little trick that’s been working for me”? It’s less about correcting and more about teaming up.

Visual or environmental cues: Sometimes modifying the environment can prevent repeated issues. Maybe the snake can be tucked away somewhere less visible so only you handle it, or even replaced with a less damaging tool if possible.

Release without repression: It’s okay to vent in safe places. Support groups, forums like this, or even a trusted friend. You deserve to be heard and to feel frustrated without guilt.

Set boundaries gently: You can still stand up for yourself, but in a way that maintains emotional safety. Something like, “I know you want to help, and I really appreciate that but this part has been a bit tricky, so I’m going to handle it today.”

This road is so complex, and grace doesn’t mean silence. It means picking your battles while still honoring your own experience. You’re doing an incredible job navigating something no one is ever fully prepared for.

You’re not just keeping a household together you’re holding a whole emotional world together. And that deserves care, too.

Sending you strength and understanding 💛