Moving LO to a condo

Caregiver222

Both my parents have dementia/AD. They both are in the moderate stage and they can no longer live in their house far from any family. My siblings want to buy a condo with my parent’s funds, move them to it and get them 24/7 care. They think my parents will easily adjust.

I’m not convinced this is the right solution. I’m worried they wouldn’t adapt and would need to be moved again, giving them more stress. Also, I’m not keen on being stuck with a condo that we may not be able to resell, especially if my parents need more liquidity in the future.

Is such a plan doable? Has anyone moved their LO closer to themselves and not put them in a senior facility, AL, MC? What was your experience?

Thank you for your input.

Quilting brings calm

Moving them close to the family is needed. Moving them to a condo is not the right solution at this stage is the disease. It’s not as easy as your family thinks to get and keep dependable 24/7 caregivers. Nor is that less expensive than an AL or MC. And that’s before buying a condo.

Moderate dementia is the latest stage that an AL would take, and it might not work out. With both of them at that stage, they cannot help care for each other.

I would suggest selling their home and furnishings where they are and moving them close to family in either an AL, MC, or one to AL and one to MC as appropriate.

Has anyone spent extended time with them… as in several days ( or a couple weeks) as the only caregiver? Because that’s the way to realize just how much care they really need

harshedbuzz

@Caregiver222

Hi and welcome. I am sorry for your reason to be here but pleased you found this place.

What your siblings are proposing can be doable. I know someone who did a similar thing putting the wife's aunt and husband's mom— both with mid-stage dementia— in a small cottage nearby with 24/7 caregivers they hired privately. Because the lived in a MCOL area with a good-sized Mennonite community available to hire from, there were only occasional no shows the wife covered. The husband was one of 6, but the only other one to really pitch in was the sister who was a live-in caregiver to their dad who was dying of CHF.

I have a friend who kept his dad in a carriage house on his property well into the later stages with part-time aides, his wife, self, brother and a large family of young adult/teenage kids keeping an eye out for dad. The kids were used to grandpop living at the end of the drive, so nothing really changed until dad became a elopement risk and developed incontinence.

That said, there can be challenges depending on what sort of assets/LTC insurance your folks bring to the table, how much hands-on work the siblings are willing to provide, whether you can easily hire aides in your community, and the presentations/personalities of the PWD. In the case of the mom who lived apart from the DH with CHF, it was because she agitated him and he could be unkind when provoked. Sometimes 2 PWD do not get along and might be better separated in different halls of a MCF.

Generally speaking, finances play into this as well. Care is very expensive and many PWD who go into facilities do spend down all their assets and require institutional Medicaid as a safety net. Where I live, most MCFs are about $10K per month although you will probably get a small discount if they share a room. Agency aides run about $40/hour and may charge additional for a second client. Ours did. You might pay less per hour if you hire privately, but that comes with vetting, payroll, scheduling and covering people who don't show.

Many of the nicer places that do accept Medicaid save their limited "Medicaid Beds" for their current residents operating under a business model that requires them to self-pay for 2-3 years. Since you would potentially be looking for 2 beds, you could end up having to split them up as they transition to Medicaid unless they're current residents of your top choice. If the sale of their home barely covers 2 years for both, I might make the safer choice and move them directly into a MCF now. But I would talk to a CELA in the state in which you plan to move them. Not all states approve Medicaid for AL/MC so they'd have to qualify for SNF level care. A certified elder law attorney would also be able to advise on other programs including VA if applicable.

HB

​fesk

I also know someone who moved their mother to an apartment and hired a 24/7 live in. When the live in went on vacation or needed to take off, the agency provided a replacement. Many live ins do not drive, so shopping, etc. still needs to be done by the family. The cost of live ins through an agency is easily over $425/day these days. Don't know how two people would be handled. That is in addition to buying food and the extra cost of utilities. It is difficult to find a good good caregivers, but it can be done. I myself have given up on caregivers these days and have taken the responsibility on full time.

Iris L.

Speaking as a condo owner, this is not a good idea. A PWD locked me inside her condo when I went to welcome her as a new neighbor. Her son had purchased the condo for her to live in. But she was delusional and paranoid and proceeded to lock me inside. I had to do some fast talking to get her to unlock the door. I told our manager I was going to call the police.

Iris

Caregiver222

https://alzconnected.org/discussion/comment/228110#Comment_228110

I’m sorry that happened to you. One of the issues I am concerned about is the liability issue and even though they would be cared for 24/7, there’s always a chance something can happen.

Caregiver222

Thank you for your insight. We’ve already had issues with private caregivers where they currently live and it’s very frustrating, especially since they live in a small town where there isn’t much availability.

Caregiver222

Great info and a lot to think about! Thank you.

SDianeL

as the disease progresses they will need more skilled nursing care. They may need hospital beds, wheelchairs. If they become wander risks they will need secure locks so they can’t leave the condo. Who will take them to doctor appointments? Shopping? Cleaning? Laundry? Cooking? Many family members say they will help but they don’t follow through. I would look for AL that also has memory care. You may have to separate them if one requires more skilled care than the other. It’s a difficult decision. I agree that a condo is not the best solution.

Iris L.

https://alzconnected.org/discussion/comment/228141#Comment_228141

A constant theme regarding in-home care is the lack of sufficient training of the caregivers and the lack of reliability. In a small town, you will probably have to do your own training, even if hiring from an agency. And be prepared for no-shows.

Iris

H1235

In AL there are multiple staff members and administrators. This creates a bit of checks and balances. With in home care you don’t have that. Seems like there would be a bigger chance of caregiver not doing a proper job since no one is there to supervise. I picture someone sitting and playing on their phone for hours rather than interacting with your lo. In a condo they will still have access to the stove and would need to be watched much more closely. I think AL would allow for more independence. They wouldn’t have some stranger always in their personal space. AL also gives them a chance to socialize with others their own age. Their living environment would be much smaller but with dementia I think they might find that less confusing and more comforting. Tough decision.

MN Chickadee

I assume money is no problem, since 24/7 care is way more expensive than moving them to a facility. But family better be ready to do A LOT. There will be constant missed shifts to cover, at minimum. And then one of the parents becomes a two-person assist for lifting and toileting, will you hire two people? Facilities are already set up for this with multiple staff on hand. If it were me, I'd find a nice assisted living place near you with memory care and move them to a place where they can actually age in place without another move in a few months. And I would NOT sign up for a condo that may be hard to get rid of. Because this won't last, one way or another. If they are moderate stage, the adjustment is going to be the same whether it's a stand alone condo or assisted living (i.e. likely hard.) They probably won't know the difference and will be out of sorts for a while regardless. But in a facility there are opportunities for activities and outings and socializing with others.
YMMV.

dancsfo

There may need to be a discussion with the condo's home owner's association. While I think they cannot discriminate against a PWD living in a condo association (i.e. prohibit living there), there is an issue with safety and risk to self and others, and you may need to demonstrate what is being done (for example, mitigation for fire dangers if a a PWD misuses a stove).

So I agree with others that a AL or MCF is a better solution, if possible.

https://how2hoa.com/dementia-in-hoa/

Iris L.

Thanks for posting the HOA Guide. In my case, I was locked inside the condo, a case of kidnapping. The door was locked and there were bars on the windows. I could have called the police and escalated the situation. But the son handled it.

Iris

Victoriaredux

There is such a demand for live-in caregivers or ones who will work the late shifts if you go that route that sometimes the marketing part of an agency will "punt" on the background checks. Commission is commission. Never go that route without making the agency tell you exactly what they check and when they received that info.

Also, if you do go that route , clear the house of financial documents and all valuables. If paintings etc. the LO would miss - hang a replica.

Even ones that give good "care" sometimes take care to make a bit on the side. We had one who proudly admitted "I went through everything".

Carl46

Moving can cause deterioration in adaptation too. In fact, any change can. I replaced our clothes dryer a couple of years ago and DW not only never did learn how to operate it, she forgot how to operate the washer. I have no intention of changing anything I don't have to, much less move her anywhere short of memory care.

harshedbuzz

@Carl46

The OP's parents live a distance away from any of their adult children. A move is going to be necessary.

TBH, I didn't see an obvious progression of symptoms with moving dad. Around the time of his eventual diagnosis, He's moved from his place in FL to his place in MD in July. In August, he had a psychotic episode that resulted in mom driving him north to PA where we took him to the ER of a university hospital with a memory center. In early September he was discharged to SNF/Rehab for a month. From there, we moved them into an apartment nearer to me. They were unhappy in the apartment, so mom and I found a house for them. The weekend I moved them in January, they stayed together in a suite style hotel to avoid dad interfering.

I know a lot of families report an obvious disease progression with a move; I didn't. Perhaps it isn't inevitable. FWIW, my aunt who developed dementia as an older widow living in a somewhat remote area actually improved when she went into memory care. The dementia-informed structure of the program and support, along with a healthier diet and socialization, allowed her to relax and function better.

HB